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Freedom Collection

Interviews with Xiqiu "Bob" Fu

Interviewed November 26, 2024

The existence of house church is really in comparison of the existence of the so-called Three Self Church, which is a government-sanctioned Protestant church denomination, we can call it. It’s called Three Self Patriotic Movement. They enjoy the government protection, you can call it.

But the majority of Chinese Protestant Christians choose to worship in the house, in their own houses. And that’s why it’s called “house church.” And it’s from 50 to 60 million members. And most of the house churches worship independent of the government control. So by that nature, they’re subject to persecution at any time. And they were declared as illegal according to the government definition of legal status.

And we, as house church members, we have to be careful. And usually we worship – it depends on the city or in the countryside. If it’s in the countryside, you worship in the early morning. You pray for two hours. And then on Sunday, or even Saturday, you have the worship time for a long time. And almost all of the leaders had been persecuted in one way or another. And it’s most of the senior leaders had experienced long term imprisonment.

And the pastor who married my wife and I, Pastor Alan Yuan, from Beijing, had experienced a 22-years and 8-months imprisonment. And the pastor who actually baptized me was imprisoned for 17 years. And among the house church pastoral leadership there’s a loose network. And there is a famous saying that the first theological course for the house church pastors is called “Prison Theology.”

So everyone has to taste the imprisonment as their first theological course for their faith. And of course Chinese government regarded the house church movement as a political threat. And it is really a misunderstanding, I think. But that’s how the house church pastors and leadership had been treated. And the members are always subject for persecution.

In terms of the differences or relationship between the government-sanctioned Three Self Patriotic Movement Church and the independent house church movement, I would say, I mean, the vast majority of those members who are worshiping in the government-sanctioned churches are evangelical Christians.

But the leadership which mean this Three Self Patriotic movement, their central leadership, provincial and local leadership, this TSPM organization, and the other one is called Chinese Christian Council (CCC), they are really nothing but a political organization just with a religious uniform. And many of them are undoubtedly Communist Party members or secret Communist Party members. So they choose to be more loyal to the Party’s interest than to the believer’s interest.

Actually, President [George W.] Bush and Secretary [of State Condoleezza] Rice both attended that church called Gangwashi Church in Beijing. But the former pastor, Pastor Yang, was publicly, in front of the congregation, removed by force by the government’s Religious Affairs Bureau officials, just simply because the church grew too fast and he baptized some young people who were under 18 years old, which is a violation of the government’s religious policy. And he was kicked out.

So we have to organize our own independent churches from that time on. And I think the younger generation of Chinese house church Christians are more willing to work together and to worship with the believers in the government-sanctioned churches because they don’t have the historical baggage.

And of course the leadership of the TPSM and the CCC remain, you know, the same. I think the difference today still remains. And in some areas the current leadership of the TSPM even participated in the persecution against their fellow house church brother and sisters. So it’s going to be very hard to have, you know, if you call it a reconciliation, unless they choose to be independent and more faithful to their faith than to their political affiliation.