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Freedom Collection

Interviews with Andrzej Gwiazda and Joanna Duda-Gwiazda

Interviewed November 26, 2024

JOANNA DUDA-GWIAZDA: I think that the paramount thing was that the economy should not be subordinate to any utopian ideology. That the economy should apply common sense, such methods, and such ideas which would simply be beneficial for the economy, and at the same time which allowed for continuous improvement in the living standard of the working people. And so that was the overall idea of the free labor unions.

ANDRZEJ GWIAZDA: Something worth noting – that in the free labor unions we met in small groups due to the security factor – there were five or six people. And so we conducted discussions, [saying] it is an obvious thing that you cannot demand more wages if you do not have a basis, an economic argument to back it up. So everybody would like to make more, but you have to have some grounds for it. So we encouraged people, and we told them about the method by which our colleagues were obliged to analyze, or give a rough analysis, at any rate, of the economic condition of their production plants. And this was met with a great deal of interest, and resulted in remarkably good success.

These young workers turned out able to decipher the economics of their employing plants remarkably well. So things would wind up more or less this way, that at the fifth or sixth session they would arrive with ready conclusions: “Andrzej, it makes no sense to be talking about free labor unions right now, what we’ve got to do is [silent expletive] get the heck away from the Soviet Union.” Because what turned out was that even in those plants which you would not have expected, they were forced to perform certain jobs practically free of charge for [supporting] the [communist] system. So in the free labor unions, every participant knew full well that independence is absolutely necessary as a pre-condition for economic success. And so we also conceived our own success along these lines: to overthrow the yoke of the power of the [Communist] Party secretaries, who were stifling the economy, its development, who stood in the way of that progress, it will result [positively] for Poland´s economy, Poland´s industry, and of course wages would spike way up.

So our assessment was that without any problem we could increase the living standard by a factor of three, to increase real wages threefold, without any danger of inflation. These were the reserves whereby, according to independent economists, 70 percent of the national product was sent out to serve the needs of the system, and only about 30 percent was left in the country, for our citizenry.